Episode 385 – While the Cats Away (The Polite Society Podcast)

The Polite Society Podcast has posted a new article Episode 385 – While the Cats Away:


Full Episode Download: http://ift.tt/2aWgaG4

1- Open and Personal News Segment:

2- News Segment:

3- Interview Segment 1: Joseph LaJoy

4- Interview Segment 2: Joseph LaJoy Pt 2

5- Interview Dr. John Edeen of GRGO.us

6- DGU Segment: 

7- Email and Show Close:

1- Introduction


Rob- Welcome to the polite society podcast sponsored by the Firearms Policy Coalition recorded on Friday, August 5th, 2016.  I’m Rob Morse.

Gary: I’m Gary Daugherty, and on tonight’s show we will talk with Joseph LaJoy about gunsmithing and state department ITAR regulations.

John: I’m John Richardson, and we’ll talk with Dr. John Edeen about protecting our hospitals from criminals and crazies.

Cheryl: I’m guest host, Cheryl Todd, and we have news and commentary about more freedom coming to Texas.

Gary: In one of our defensive gun use stories, a young woman was robbed and held with a gun to her head.  She fought back and won.. Because she had a gun and knew how to use it. .. so climb aboard.

Cheryl: strap in

John : and hang on!

Rob: episode 385 of the Polite Society Podcast starts right now.

Show intro music.


Personal news from each participant (when you are done with your segment please ask the next person what has been up with them)

Rob: Paul, Susan and Rachel are at a Kathy Jackson training class today, So John, what have you been doing about self-defense this week?


John – Other than trying to stay armed where allowed, not too much. I usually spend at least two days a week working in a hospital where guns are forbidden and the security force is unarmed. That makes it hard. I also had to spend two days at a company conference which was interesting but certainly not gun related. Speaking of conferences, I have made my hotel and plane reservations for GRPC.


I did pick up a new set of reloading dies for when I finally get my bench set up. Now if I only had a basement set up like our own Charlie Foxtrot I’d be in reloading and gunsmithing heaven!



Cheryl Todd- .

Rob- I carried every day.  I made flight and hotel reservations for the gun rights policy conference in Tampa.  I was listening to some training podcasts and I was surprised at how little we can learn at one time.



Gary- MAG 40 in June 2017. Please email Susan@politicsandguns.com for class info and to reserve seats.  We will be back with news about repealing gun control in Texas after this break.



2- News 1


Gary- Texas Campus Carry

Congratulations to the state of Texas, to it’s citizens and college students. Campus carry of a handgun is now legal in the Lone Star State.  And the right to self-defense is recognized in some of the state’s most unlikely institutions as of August 1st.  While there are still some restricted areas where concealed carry is not allowed, such as sports arenas and chemical laboratories. The potential that a criminal may choose an armed (quote) “victim” will likely curb the number of violent encounters on campus. As author and economist Dr. John Lott has demonstrated, more guns really do equal less crime.


Licensed concealed carry is now allowed in campus parking lots, parking garages, outdoor walkways, and inside school buildings. Universities may designate certain areas as Gun Free Zones, so watch for the 306 signs.  This new legislation applies to 4 year colleges.  It will apply to two year junior colleges in September of next year.


Rob- Some of the college administrators and faculty tried to be clever.  They tried to make gun-free zones out of some of the places students were required to go.  The Texas Attorney General said their restrictions violate the law.  Some of the academics are flush with their display of anti- gun bigotry and values signaling.  


John – Anti’s were making a big deal over the fact that it started on the anniversary of the UT Belltower Shooting in 1966. What they forgot to say, it was students with their deer rifles who provided suppressing fire for the cops so they could get up in the tower to kill the sniper.


Cheryl- rape rate should fall.



John- Someone messed with Texas..and got sued

Still in Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton sued the Austin municipal government for posting signs against open carry.  Most of the anti-rights bigots have an attitude of catch me if you can, but this suit has teeth in the form of daily fines that increase rapidly.


The lawsuit claims Austin illegally posted city hall.  The city says that city hall is a court building.. Without a courtroom.  The Attorney General’s couldn’t find  a court or office utilized by a government court within the city hall building.  The city faces fines of $1,000-$1,500 per day for the first offence, and 10 thousand a day for repeat violations.


Rob- Well that should get their attention.. And the attention of the Austin taxpayers who are being abused.

Cheryl -Missouri Constitutional Carry

In other state’s news Missouri’s Governor Jay Nixon vetoed the bill that passed both the state house and senate which would allow Missourians to conceal carry a firearm without a state issued permit. Opponents of the bill, including some from within the pro-gun community, say that concealed weapons should be carried by trained and qualified citizens. At the time of the Democrat governor’s veto, Republican lawmakers vowed to override the veto in September. It should be noted that Missouri already has allowances for the open carry of firearms without a permit. If you live in the state of Missouri, contact your representatives and state senators to let them know how you feel about this legislation and the possible upcoming veto override vote.

Do criminals follow any gun laws?  

John – CF made the point that many politicians in MO brag on their NRA ratings.

Cheryl – solving a problem that doesn’t exist


Rob- ATF Caught with illegal firearm purchase records

According to the US Government Accountability Office (GAO for short), the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives has once again violated regulations by maintaining records of sales of multiple firearms. FFLs are required by statute to report to ATF the sale of two or more handguns to the same purchaser within five consecutive business days. The ATF is supposed to keep these records for two years after which they are required to remove any identifying customer data if the firearms have not been used during the commission of a crime. This is not the first time that the government has failed to properly destroy these records. The GAO reported the same issue in 1996, the 2016 report shows that the ATF is at least in part placing the blame on the computer database system that they use. A majority of the found records are from FFL dealers that are no longer in business. According to the GAO, firearms dealers can elect to voluntarily provide these records rather than have the ATF contact them for individual firearm tracking.


There is a congressional mandate that requires that approved purchaser information is to be destroyed within twenty-four hours. This has been included in the appropriations bills funding the Department of Justice to prevent over reaches by the ATF and the FBI. But once again, the rules do not apply to the rule makers.


Cheryl- You can be sued into bankruptcy for a small violation, say of the patient protection act.  My personal data has been stolen from government servers. And each time this happens, a government official faces no penalties for misconduct.  When has a government official lost their job and their pension?  We have smart listeners, let us know if you find the examples I missed.


Gary- Chicago shows that Failing Cities are Dangerous

Last month was the “deadliest July in 10 years” for heavily gun-controlled Chicago: Sixty-five individuals were shot and killed.  That isn’t an all time record, but it matches the murder rate set in July of 2006.  It looks like 2016 will be far deadlier than 2015.


Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson tried to abate the media criticism from the July death numbers by pointing out that they are at least better than the numbers for June, “when 72 homicides were reported.”


Comments? Rob

John – no gang suppression.


John- The Chicago Tribune reported a total of 2,395 shooting victims so far in 2016.  We see this violence in spite of the city’s bigoted “assault weapons” ban, their “violence tax,” their strict rules on acquiring handguns, and micro-management of the number of gun stores.  Gun control is a distraction from the failed economic and social policies of Chicago politicians.


Rob-  I’m angry at Chicago politicians.  The blood of innocents is real.  It isn’t a political talking point.


Rob-  Is the Chicago media helping the politicians promote their anti-gun bigotry?


Cheryl-Nevada Sheriffs Give Bloomberg the Cold Shoulder.

Most Nevada Sheriffs came out against the Bloomberg-funded background check ballot initiative. “Any bill that does not address mental health, which I believe to be the core cause of the violence we’ve had across the country, does not meet my expectations,” said Kenny Furlong, sheriff in Carson City. “Mental health has to be addressed.”


Sheriff Sharon Wehrly in Nye County said she believed the initiative chips away at Second Amendment rights.  “It merely places more restrictions on good people, will make it more difficult, and incur unnecessary costs for law-abiding citizens to manage their personal property,” she said.


A yes vote would require background checks through a licensed gun dealer when firearms change hands, except for temporary transfers of a weapon while hunting or target shooting, for immediate self-defense, and transfers between immediate family members.  For example, you and your live in girlfriend could not touch each others guns.. Even if you both have a concealed carry licenses.  You could not let your sister in law touch your firearms.  There is not temporary provision for transfer.  A licensed dealer would be allowed to charge a fee for a background check.


Rob- I’m still trying to find out if the law applies to air-rifles.  The real problem is that criminals get their guns criminally.

Gary- The real problem is that too many voters surf headlines rather than study the proposals.

John- Bloomberg dropped four million dollars to promote this initiative.  He will flood the uniformed voters with feel-good campaign promises. That said, I think we need to make sure the unions and casinos understand what will happen if this passes – the SHOT Show should and must move out of LV.


Cheryl – has anyone talked to the NSSF about the SHOT show angle?

The contact information for NSSF is here=>http://ift.tt/2bvv3TN


John- Gun Quotes- I could never be a conspiracy theorist.  Conspiracy theorists believe in government competence.  Miguel Gonzalez

Miguel is from Venezuela, and writes his excellent blog- Gun Free Zone.  Hang on everybody, we’ll be back with our guests Joseph La Joy  and Dr John Edeen.



3- Interview 1 Joseph LaJoy – http://ift.tt/2aWfPDu


Twist rate

ITAR restrictions now applied to gunsmiths –

Eye dominance.  Sight focus or target focus.





Be careful  If you improve your glasses you may need to register with ITAR for improving your accuracy.   

John – Interesting on women and x-dom. What do you think about blacking out the the rear dots with a Sharpie?


4- Interview 2 7:15 John Edeen, In the Crosshairs: Are Our Hospitals Targets for Terrorist Attacks?

History of terrorism



Hospitals are already sites for workplace violence

Hospitals are frequent targets for terrorism

Rob- John, most americans think terrorism doesn’t happen since they ignored it.  Politicians abet their ignorance.

Types of attacks

John, isn’t a hospital also the ideal structure for a distributed defense?

Cheryl –

Gary – At the NRAAM, Lt Col Grossman warned about Hospital and daycare and elementary school attacks. Frightening.  

Rob- John, money talks, and some corporate risk analyst told the hospital administrator that he has to sacrifice his staff.  What allowed a hospital to deflect liability in the US?

State prohibitions for defense.

What laws need to change?  Carry or liability?  An unguarded hospital is an attractive nuisance to terrorist attacks.


5- DGUs  Our disclaimer is that you need training, and these stories are NOT training.


Rob – Michael Cargill’s Parent’s Endure Home Invasion

Our first DGU strikes far too close to home. Michael Cargill, a tireless advocate for the 2nd Amendment, talkshow host, concealed carry instructor, gun store owner and friend of this podcast, had his parents involved in a deadly home invasion. Fortunately, his family is shaken, but okay.

In the outskirts of Atlanta, four men tried to break into a rural home early in the morning. They stole a swimming pool ladder to get to a second story window. Awakened around 4, the owner found a man climbing through his master bathroom window. In that terrible situation, Cargill’s stepfather shot to defend his wife and his own life. Michael Silva, 25, was hit in the face and died on the home’s roof. He was on parole for a 2013 case and had recently been arrested for drunkenness. Silva lived less than a half mile from the burglary that cost him his life. His confederates have not been caught.  

In the past, Michael Cargill had run his parents through his handgun license course. Afterward, he helped guide them through the post shooting minefield. He made sure they had called 911 and then provided some needed advice. “I don’t want them making any statements at all and saying the wrong thing and getting themselves in trouble.” He also worked with a Texas firearms legal defense group insurance group to arrange for a Georgia attorney. Cargill did well, as his parents were taken to jail, questioned and then released without charges being filed. “The homeowner was well within the boundaries of Georgia law’s defense of habitation statute,” according to a police spokesman.  Even though his parents were clearly the victims, their house was “very thoroughly” searched by police, a second traumatic violation of their home.

We at the Polite Society Podcast wish Michael Cargill’s parents all the best. “They’re really broken up by this…having to stop someone and take someone’s life,” Cargill said. “It changes you.” The changes that perhaps allowed his parents to survive had started years earlier when Cargill’s grandmother was robbed and raped on a college campus. “From that point on, I decided I wanted to make sure that every female and everyone in their family had the tools they needed to protect themselves to stop those threats,” Cargill said. “We did not want to become victims anymore.  And I’m so glad today justifies what I did back then.  Because my parents had the tools they needed to protect themselves and stop that threat.”


Michael Cargill’s talk show discussion about the shooting can be found here in the shownotes. It’s highly recommended.  


Gary –


Gary – CCW Carrier Helps Officer

An Ohio citizen “Backed the Blue” in a very direct way, using his concealed carry pistol. Last year, Corporal Michael Wheeler of the Mount Vernon Police Department was attacked by a crystal meth addict. The man knocked the police officer onto his back and pinned him to the ground. The perp was about to get to Wheeler’s duty weapon when Dylan DeBoard interveined. The concealed weapon permit holder leveled his gun at the criminal, who stopped his attacks and put his hands up. Wheeler then flipped his attacker and put him in cuffs.    


This week, DeBoard was honored by Mount Vernon with their Citizen’s Award of Valor. Corporal Wheeler was there to present the award. “Every time I see him I let him know how much I appreciate what he did,” the officer said. “I wish a lot more of society would do what he did. There were people standing around, but they were just watching. I kept wondering why people didn’t do anything.”

We can only echo Corporal Wheeler’s words – all of them. Well done, Mr DeBoard. Well done, indeed.  


Rob- Get involved.


John – Woman Defends Her Life and the Life of Her Unborn Child
A Birmingham, Alabama woman was forced to fight for her life — and the life of her unborn child. The five-month pregnant woman awoke to the sounds of an air conditioner being ripped from a window. She grabbed her gun, and in her own words, “I walked out of the door and I saw them, the guy in the hallway … he was kind of close to me so I shot and he fell. And from that point, I went and turned on the lights and I called the police.”  Police transported the criminal to the hospital. He is expected to survive.

Marquita Turner says she’s not scared, but she will be moving. This is the fourth time her home has been burglarized in the seven months she’s lived there. “You have to protect yourself. Without a doubt. Take matters into your own hands. Get some type of protection. Don’t take anything for granted. You got to protect you and your child. Be strong. If it comes down to that, then that’s what you have to do. Don’t be scared,” Turner said. Her protection took the form of a pink Taurus Millennium 9. “This was my first time pointing and shooting. I never been to a gun range. I never went to target practice or anything. I was just, at the time, protecting myself.”


This brave mother-to-be certainly protected herself. As well as the life she was carrying. However, we are delighted to know she will be moving.


Gary –

Rob- Please get training.  Also get your concealed carry permit so you carry every place, and all the time.

John – I think suppressed firearms making training for newbies much easier.

Cheryl – I am afraid that her admitting to not being trained could have opened her to civil legal action.  u


Cheryl – It’s a Miracle!
A woman at a Circle-K suddenly found herself with a gun pointed at her head. A man had grabbed the 23-year-old victim at about 1 am in the Phoenix, Arizona area gas station. However, the robbery didn’t go as he planned. Witnesses saw the woman, still with a gun to her skull, pull her handgun from a hip holster and shoot the attacker. Frank Taylor, 27, died from the single gunshot. The victim escaped to call 911 from her home, saying she was in fear for her life. Police found that evidence from the scene supported her and the witnesses’ descriptions of an armed assault and robbery. In Constitutional Carry Arizona, she was a legal carrier. As a matter of course, the shooting will be given to the Maricopa County Attorney’s Office to determine if charges will be filed. However, police believe this is a clear case of self-defense and no charges are likely.


By the way, the victim’s name was Carol Miracle. Yes, Shannon, this self-defense use of a handgun was a miracle, just not the way you expected it.


Rob – Darwin is Waiting at a Gun Store
Sometimes you just have to ask: Just what the hell were you thinking, man? Two future Darwin Award nominees decided to rob a gun store. — And very predictably, got shot at for their troubles.  

The two feckless criminals went to rob Jim’s Gun Store in North Carolina late in the afternoon. A gun store employee and customer noticed the undynamic duo sculking around the carport wearing white masks. That won’t attract attention, huh? The employee tried to lock the store’s doors, but the two got past him after a struggle. As you would expect of someone in a gunstore, the employee had his pants on, and therefore his gun on, and he shot at the robbers.

The gunplay apparently surprised the two master thieves, and they bailed out and escaped in a green car. Deputies arrived to wrap the scene in festively colored crime-scene tape. They have been unable to determine if either suspect was hit by the employee’s fire and there have been no arrests.

We know that Willie Sutton said he robbed banks because “That was where the money is”; but going where the guns are could definitely get you a ride on a mortuary slab.  


John – I’m sorry this doesn’t speak well for the intelligence of our criminals in North Carolina. Thank goodness!


John – Don’t Torque-Off the Old Gal – Who’s Got a Shotgun

We’ve got another in our Don’t Torque-Off the Old Gal series!  

Two thieves probably thought the seasoned citizen was an easy mark when they broke into her Hillsboro, Missouri home late one night. They quickly learned the error of their ways – at the muzzle of a shotgun. The 77-year-old homeowner heard a noise in the night. She went to investigate and found two intruders in her spare bedroom. Before they could get froggy, she stuffed her shotgun into their faces, prompting a panicked retreat out the bathroom window they broke into.  

The goofs left a cell phone and burglary tools behind. The police were able to recognize this as a clue, and identified a 28-year-old as a “person of interest.” However, to date, no arrests have been made.   


Neredowells should note that the shotgunner lives in a nest of feisty and capable old guys and gals. Doris Jackson, 87, said “The victim is not the only senior citizen in the neighborhood with a gun. How about a nine millimeter? I wouldn’t have a shotgun, but I have some more besides that, I’ve got some guns, you know,” boasted the prickly old gal. The sheriff’s department said they would prefer a call to 911 if an intruder is heard. They further urged victims to leave the work to the professionals, who would arrive RealSoonNow. However, the department did acknowledge that Jackson and her neighbors have their right to protect themselves. Ol’ Doris isn’t scared, she and her torqued-off neighbors are armed, and we’ll bet VERY dangerous…  

You go, grrrrls! You just don’t torque-off a shotgun grandmomma!


John – I agree with Cheryl about this. We’ve reported stories like this in the past.



Gary- We post each of our news and defensive gun use articles at Polite Society Podcast.com  Please take a minute and share them with a friend.



6- E-mail, blog notes, and show close


Listener e-mail discussion


John- Email #1


Hello all,


I’ve been listening to the Polite Society Podcast, as well as a number of other gun and second amendment related podcasts for a few years now.  I have learned so much from listening to you guys, and ladies…:-)  As a matter of fact your podcast is what motivated me the most to seek professional firearms training.  


Living here in Olympia, WA., I’m only about an hour away from the Firearms Academy of Seattle (FAS).  Back in July I took their one day Concealed Carry course, and guess who the lead instructor was?  Kathy Jackson.  She was awesome!  I hope to get into their two day Defensive Handgun class before the end of this year.  My ultimate goal is to do a MAG40 next year.


Anyway to the subject, the election.  Folks this “vote your conscious” and some of your theories on how a state will vote, or relying on Congress to save us just adds up to a win for Clinton.  Is a Clinton win really what you want?  Is it?  Trump was picked as the Republican candidate.  Get over it!  Was he the best the republicans could do, heck no, but he is it this year.  One candidate will continue to harass us gun owners, and work hard to chip away at our rights primarily by appointing anti-gun judges, and the other candidate will not.  As pro 2nd amendment as you and I are there should be no doubt who to vote for.


Okay, I’m calm again…lol.  Anyway keep up the great work you all do.





Olympia Wa.


Retired USAF

NRA member

Member Armed Citizen Legal Defense Network




Gary – Listener Email #2


Hey guys, had a few questions on carry ammo. I swap out my self defense ammo once a year and that replaced ammo then becomes practice ammo.


I just finished this yearly ritual and I changed from The Remington 124 Gr +P Golden Saber “Black-Belt” loading and moved over to use Hornady’s 135Gr +P “Critical Duty” Bonded loading. To my understanding, this lround was recently adopted by the Texas Highway Patrol for use in their new Sig 320 duty pistols, and from what i read passes the FBI test through all barriers.


When looking at the box though, it is labeled right on the box “Law enforcement use only”, and when I went back and checked, and old Remington loads i was using before say “designed for Law Enforcement”. My questions are as follows….


#1) if I am in a self defense scenario, what is the group’s thoughts on my using this loading considering the labeling. I can just hear some Assistant DA telling the jury, “This guy was a wanna be cop, he even had to use the same bullets they do” or some similar nonsense. I doubt the wording on the box carry’s the force of law but it makes me think.



Danny –


#2) Why would manufacturers label their boxes in such a way?


#3) i am curious, if you guys don’t mind, what is your own round of choice for your carry weapons and what is the process you go though to determine what you round you pick?


Many thanks and keep up the good work,


Dean from Pittsburgh




Gary: Rob, do you have any new posts from your SlowFacts blog you want to mention?


Rob-  I’ve been promoting an article by Laura Carno.  She wrote about protecting students in schools.  I wrote a review of Chris Bird’s book, Surviving a Mass Killer Rampage.  My articles are up at Clash Daily, at Ammoland, and blog at slow facts dot wordpress dot com.  John, tell us what’s new at your blog only guns and money


John- I just put up a post this evening before recording the podcast. It was about President Obama’s commutation of sentences for 214 “mostly non-violent” drug offenders. That would be OK if they were really non-violent. Over ¼ had convictions for firearms crimes including at least 25 felons in possession. Moreover, if you are conspiring to smuggle over 9,000 kilos of cocaine into the country, I’m wondering just how “non-violent” the process was from start to finish. A client said something to me about these commutations that made a lot of sense. Junkies will do anything to get their next fix including killing you and me. Maybe drug offenses are not so non-violent.


That and more is at only guns and money dot blogspot dot com.


Cheryl  – If you want me to mention my guests this week on Gun Freedom Radio – I have a fun lineup: Guests:

Chris Bird – author of Surviving a Mass Killer Rampage: When Seconds Count, Police Are Still Minutes Away

Regis Giles (pronounced Jiles) – is the creator and owner of Girls Just Wanna Have Guns.com

Dave Cole –contributor to Kenn Blanchard’s Black Man With A Gun website.

-Congressman Steve Russell  of Oklahoma – also a gun manufacturer and owner of Two Rivers Arms.


We would like to thank Charlie Foxtrot for writing up show notes for us. Even though you don’t hear him on the air he is certainly part of what you do hear. Look at his blog at not one more gun law dot blogspot dot com


John: That wraps up another episode of the Polite Society Podcast.  I’d like to thank guests Joseph La Joy  and Dr John Edeen and Cheryl Todd.for joining us today.  So for our regular cast of Charlie Foxtrot, Gary, Rob, Rachel, Susan, and Paul,

(Paul, stop talking now)


Rob: Until the next time…

Gary: stay safe,

Cheryl: be aware,

John: and we’ll see you down the road.

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